{"content":{"sharePage":{"page":0,"digests":[{"id":"20063779","dateCreated":"1265899471","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"yura","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/yura","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"},"monitored":false,"locked":false,"links":{"self":"https:\/\/kisapenglporter2009-10.wikispaces.com\/share\/view\/20063779"},"dateDigested":1532170839,"startDate":null,"sharedType":"discussion","title":"8. What does the speaker mean in line 51?","description":"For I have known them all already, known them all\u2014
\nHave known the evenings, mornings, afternoons,
\n*I have measured out my life with coffee spoons;<\/strong>*
\nI know the voices dying with a dying fall
\nBeneath the music from a farther room.
\n So how should I presume?
\n
\n"I have measured out my life with coffee spoons"
\n
\nIt's evident from the poem that the narrator is not included in the society. The narrator describes the society he sees in the industrial city with much detail. He describes the society as luxurious; however, he makes these people sound thoughtless as they enjoy the present unlike him, who plans ahead. Obviously, the coffee spoon represents a social aspect because people have coffee while socializing. Hence, it's ironic that the author would measure his life with a coffee spoon. Therefore, it's possible to conclude that the author is ridiculing the people in the society as they simply concentrate on socializing and enjoying the moment.","replyPages":[{"page":0,"digests":[{"id":"20090609","body":"I thought differently. With all the descriptions of him going through the city and socializing in coffee shops, it seemed to me that he was included in society. The coffee spoon indicated to me that he found his life to be so meaningless that it can be measured by something so small as a coffee spoon.","dateCreated":"1265928365","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"jasoncho92","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/jasoncho92","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20090953","body":"--","dateCreated":"1265928677","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"lporter","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/lporter","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}}],"more":0}]},{"id":"20055185","dateCreated":"1265866241","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"lporter","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/lporter","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"},"monitored":false,"locked":false,"links":{"self":"https:\/\/kisapenglporter2009-10.wikispaces.com\/share\/view\/20055185"},"dateDigested":1532170839,"startDate":null,"sharedType":"discussion","title":"2. Rhyme Scheme (biblical to trivial)","description":"Some information: The sense of suffering is essential to "Prufrock." At the same time Eliot was revising drafts of "Prufrock," he began writing "The Lov Song of Saint Sebastian" and other poetic fragments that were directly linked to Christian martyres. St. Sebastian was pierced by many arrows, all over his body, and metaphorically his image has come to represent the lings and arrows of personal doubt and public misunderstanding that all individuals suffer in their lives.
\n
\nEliot sought religion as the bedrock for meaning that modern life lacked and for solace form egoistic dilemas, such as Prufrock's. He is much impressed, or depressed, by the disunity and chaos of modern life, the disillusion and despair of an age that lacked the sense of the absolute.
\n
\nFeeling so sharply the need for faith, Eliot found himself becoming more and more receptive to traditional, ritualistic religion. Eventually, in his later years, in Eliot's writing TRADITION meant the Christian tradition.
\n
\nSo the question again . . . how does the rhyme and rhythm of the poem take this from the biblical to the trivial? Go ahead take a risk.","replyPages":[{"page":0,"digests":[],"more":0}]},{"id":"20029953","dateCreated":"1265832766","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"courteneykim","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/courteneykim","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"},"monitored":false,"locked":false,"links":{"self":"https:\/\/kisapenglporter2009-10.wikispaces.com\/share\/view\/20029953"},"dateDigested":1532170839,"startDate":null,"sharedType":"discussion","title":"3. Describe the female imagery. How does it seem to be both positive and negative?","description":""And I have known the arms already, known them all\u2014
\nArms that are braceleted and white and bare
\n[But in the lamplight, downed with light brown hair!]
\nIt is perfume from a dress
\nThat makes me so digress?
\nArms that lie along a table, or wrap about a shawl.
\n And should I then presume?
\n And how should I begin?" (62-69)
\n
\nIn this stanza, the imagery of women seems to be very positive; the speaker describes women's arms as "braceleted and white and bare...with light brown hair!"(63-64). He is entranced by women's beauty as we also see in "Is it perfume from a dress\/ that makes me so digress?" (64-65). While the speaker does describe women in a positive way, he is only talking of their body, their hair, their smell, and he does not seem to focus on a certain woman, just any. He is in love with the idea of women, not necessary women or a woman.
\n
\nDoes anyone get the significance of the mermaids near the end of the poem?
\n
\nThis is T.S. Eliot reading the poem if you want to give it a listen.
\nhttp:\/\/www.youtube.com\/watch?v=NhiCMAG658M<\/a>","replyPages":[{"page":0,"digests":[{"id":"20037411","body":"
\nI really agree with you that the speaker is in love with the "idea of the women" rather than on a certain woman. Throughout the whole poem, he keeps talking of "the women" and "them" instead of talking about a woman or a her. And all those descriptions of the women make him look very superficial.. it's like he only cares about the physique of the women, and not their minds or thoughts. And when he talks about himself, he only cares about his looks..
\n
\n
\n"Shall I part my hair behind? Do I dare to eat a peach?
\nI shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
\nI have heard the mermaids singing, each to each.
\n
\nI do not think that they will sing to me.
\n
\nI have seen them riding seaward on the waves
\nCombing the white hair of the waves blown back
\nWhen the wind blows the water white and black.
\n
\nWe have lingered in the chambers of the sea
\nBy sea-girls wreathed with seaweed red and brown
\nTill human voices wake us, and we drown."
\n
\nHe wonders if he should "part his hair behind"and what kind of clothes he should wear.
\n
\nAnd as for the significance of the mermaids, I think they represent the same women he talks about in the beginning of the poem? Mermaids are beautiful, but they cannot communicate with humans. (either by language or because they live in sea). So it fits perfectly that he would compare the women to mermaids since he only seems to care about how they look anyway. What do you think?","dateCreated":"1265841790","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"syclair","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/syclair","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20038049","body":"Maybe he is saying that women have a world of their own? Maybe that's a bit far fetched...
\nWhat really confused me were the last two lines of the poem: "By sea-girls wreathed with seaweed red and brown\/ Till human voices wake us, and we drown. (130-131)"
\n
\n'And would it have been worth it, after all,
\nWould it have been worth while,
\nAfter the sunsets and the dooryards and the sprinkled streets,
\nAfter the novels, after the teacups, after the skirts that trail along the floor\u2014
\nAnd this, and so much more?\u2014
\nIt is impossible to say just what I mean!
\nBut as if a magic lantern threw the nerves in patterns on a screen:
\nWould it have been worth while
\nIf one, settling a pillow or throwing off a shawl,
\nAnd turning toward the window, should say:
\n \u201cThat is not it at all,
\n That is not what I meant, at all.\u201d' (99-110)
\n
\nIn addition, I think he is also in love with the life that having a wife or a significant other will bring. He talks of "Sunsets", "dooryards", "teacups", "novels", and "skirts that trail along the floor" (101-103).
\n
\nSo, the imagery itself is positive, but the way he treats it is negative because he doesn't love women, just their looks and the kind of life they represent?","dateCreated":"1265842474","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"courteneykim","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/courteneykim","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20038239","body":"Well. I guess we don't know whether he cares more about women for more than their looks and the companionship... but that's the impression i got from the poem. Maybe the "human voices" that "wake us" represent important things about women other than looks? So confusinggggg.. lol","dateCreated":"1265842661","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"syclair","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/syclair","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20055503","body":"I feel Prufrock is a man who finds physical appearances very significant factors. This can be seen when he talks about his OWN insecurities about his looks. In line 40, he says, "With a bald spot in the middle of my hair - (They will say "How his hair is growing thin!")... (They will say: "But how is arms and legs are thin!")..." He also compares women to "mermaids," which are beautiful creatures in the seaworld. This reminded me alot of the play, "The Doll's House" by Henry Ibsen. It seems Prufrock fantasizes women as perfect, lovely things like dolls, and he does not look at their sentiments, their personality, or who they really are.","dateCreated":"1265867185","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"rachelrox","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/rachelrox","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20060813","body":"I agree with you. The narrator is ironic because he describes women with elegant and positive words but seem to criticize them at the same time. I got a sense that these women are thoughtless because they look beautiful but they just enjoy the moment rather than thinking about the future like he does.","dateCreated":"1265893363","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"yura","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/yura","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20068023","body":"Overall, all of you have pointed out that Prufrock is simplistic in his portrayal of women. Hence although he may uphold their looks and appearance, women are in the end, flesh and bone that are 'good to look at.'
\n
\nI also agree with this point. To go further though, I would even say that Prufrock also suggests that women are stuck in the past with the line
\n"In the room the women come and go
\nTalking of Michelangelo."
\nIf anything that he is not, michelangelo is NOt a modernist artist. His ornate, realistic paintings merit detail and technique - the very aspects of art that the Modernists rejected. Hence, we can picture Prufrock, at the teaparty, rapt in his own thoughts, as the stupid women walk around talking about Michelangelo's ornate paintings, that are, in Prufrock's eyes, so very Pre-modernist.","dateCreated":"1265903803","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"yongminc10","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/yongminc10","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20091045","body":"--","dateCreated":"1265928755","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"lporter","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/lporter","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}}],"more":0}]},{"id":"20011763","dateCreated":"1265810888","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"jyang10","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/jyang10","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"},"monitored":false,"locked":false,"links":{"self":"https:\/\/kisapenglporter2009-10.wikispaces.com\/share\/view\/20011763"},"dateDigested":1532170840,"startDate":null,"sharedType":"discussion","title":"9. Lines 49-69, Identify the poem's use of repetition. What effect does repetition have on the poem's meaning?","description":"Prufrock's anxiety is not only limited to the physical evidence of his body's aging but also in his mental obsession with time itself. Eliot writes Prufrock's dramatic monologue with precision, capturing Prufrock's worry in even the slightest repetition. Prufrock's obsession leaking through his unconsciousness can be shown through the repetition of the word "And" (21), and the word "all" at the end of several lines (49,55,62). Prufrock's use of "And" shows the passage of time as the poem follows a linear story, but "And" suddenly disappears from the beginning of the last stanza as Prufrock hints at life coming to its end. Interesting!!!!! Also, the repetition of "all" appears frequently but it also disappears at the end of the poem, at the end of life. By using repetition until the last stanza, Eliot is clearly conveys Prufrock\u2019s perception in life that "all" is accounted for and examined as an accumulation of the body of work's worth. Prufrock regrets that at his old age, his "all" amounts to very little: "I have measured out my life with coffee spoons;" (51).","replyPages":[{"page":0,"digests":[{"id":"20041989","body":"nice","dateCreated":"1265846589","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"lporter","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/lporter","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}}],"more":0}]},{"id":"20009043","dateCreated":"1265801521","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"dabinl","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/dabinl","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"},"monitored":false,"locked":false,"links":{"self":"https:\/\/kisapenglporter2009-10.wikispaces.com\/share\/view\/20009043"},"dateDigested":1532170840,"startDate":null,"sharedType":"discussion","title":"1. Describe the setting(s). How do they reflect the character of Prufrock? What kind of world does he live in?","description":"\u201cThe yellow fog\u201d and \u201cyellow smoke\u201d indicate that the character (Prufrock) lives in an industrial city. Instead of describing busy, lively cosmopolitan life, the narrator rather focuses on a mundane life style in which people simply \u201ccome and go\u201d. The repetition\u2014involving two lines: \u201cIn the room the women come and go \/ Talking of Michelangelo\u201d\u2014directly show the repeated nature of city life. The narrator continuously mentions the smoke: \u201cThe yellow smoke that rubs its muzzle on the window-panes\u201c (16), \u201cthe yellow smoke that slides along the street\u201d (24), \u201cthe smoke that rises from the pipes\u201d (71). Smoke represents the narrator himself: 1) Smoke is not so welcomed, and so is the narrator. He expresses his worries about being rejected. 2) Smoke soon becomes invisible as it disperses; the narrator also feels as if he has no definite place to stand or belong to. The world around him, according to the poem, definitely is dark, full of repetition, and mundane; however, the narrator also tends to focus on the darker, lonelier side of the city, proving his apparent pessimistic character.","replyPages":[{"page":0,"digests":[{"id":"20009321","body":"I agree with you that the setting helps characterize the narrator's personality\/inner-working mind: lonely, scared and indecisive. The narrator describes the dark and the shabby part of the city, which helps create a suspenseful mood. "streets that follow like a tedious argument\/of insidious intent" (7) definitely shows how much doubt he has about himself and the world, which he resides in. I felt that throughout the poem, he was unsure about everything, questioning every move, including his surroundings. The setting plays a big role in emphasizing such characteristic.","dateCreated":"1265803608","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"chaerij","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/chaerij","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20042137","body":"-","dateCreated":"1265846753","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"lporter","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/lporter","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20060625","body":"You have good points here and the things you mention clarify some major themes in this poem. I think the narrator is evidently secluded from this "industrial city" but at the same time, I felt as if the narrator was criticizing these people in the main stream society. The yellow smoke for me proved that the setting is in a industrial city but it also brought up a negative image of the people living surrounded by this yellow smoke. Yet, the narrator seems to exclude himself from the yellow smoke, which I think is the main stream of the society.","dateCreated":"1265892691","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"yura","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/yura","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20090959","body":"My group discussed the yellow smoke as well. But instead of taking it literally, we found that the smoke actually represents a cat since later it "Slipped by the terrace, made a sudden leap." The descriptions of the cat having a muzzle narrowed it down to a dog or cat, but the sudden leap made it obvious that it was a cat.","dateCreated":"1265928678","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"jasoncho92","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/jasoncho92","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20091011","body":"--","dateCreated":"1265928721","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"lporter","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/lporter","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}}],"more":0}]},{"id":"20008741","dateCreated":"1265799068","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"jyang10","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/jyang10","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"},"monitored":false,"locked":false,"links":{"self":"https:\/\/kisapenglporter2009-10.wikispaces.com\/share\/view\/20008741"},"dateDigested":1532170841,"startDate":null,"sharedType":"discussion","title":"1. Describe the setting(s). How do they reflect the character of Prufrock? What kind of world does he live in?","description":"Prufrock lives in a dark, smelly neighborhood of the big metropolis in October. Steam rises from the streets, and a sick yellow fog circulates around the crooked houses. Drunks are stumble out of the "sawdust restaurants" and sloppy-looking couples argue outside of "cheap hotels."
\n
\nThe poem\u2019s setting is bad, though it looks nice on the surface. It is a fancy city of the tired and bored middle-class, sitting in their cramped rooms drinking tea and coffee all day. In other parts of the house, people are talking and laughing and music is playing; yet people seem to just lie around and grow older.
\n
\nThe setting clearly makes the readers to feel a sense of isolation because the world just moves on and doesn\u2019t care about this serious individual, supposedly Prufrock, who is deeply contemplating about his aging. The bright fancy setting directly contrasts to this dim, tragic speaker and thereby, emphasizes the frustration that Prufrock is going through. Eliot's Prufrock is saddened by his inability to act and his insecurities and has anxiety toward watching his time disappear, which establishes him as a tragic case of life coming to its twilight era too soon. Prufrock's age would not be his concern if he was able to take action, but it is his fear of being rejected due to his age, which stops him from obtaining a companion and security in his future. Prufrock is drawn to "dare" (38) because his time for action is fading, yet it is time which aged him, instilling in him the worry that stops him from taking action\u2014time conquers J. Alfred Prufrock.","replyPages":[{"page":0,"digests":[{"id":"20009065","body":"I explored the same topic as well; I guess the setting (which is an industrialized city) is quite apparent after reading a series of descriptions. I came to similar conclusions as yours, yet I haven't noticed the man's concern about aging. Now I see how the physical inferiority and certain negative effects of aging add even more to the man's pessimism.","dateCreated":"1265801756","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"dabinl","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/dabinl","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20009237","body":"Yeah. I think that there is a sense of irony in that the women talk of michaelangelo, the perfect man, while they reside and are a part of an imperfect(and no where near perfect) setting. I think this adds to the poem by pointing out the un-optimistic view of modernism.","dateCreated":"1265803085","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"goblinj","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/goblinj","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20012155","body":"I think there\u2019s something really interesting going on about the women that the speaker talks about. For example, Prufrock predicts what the women will be doing at the party: "In the room the women come and go\/ Talking of Michelangelo." (13-14, 35-36). Aside from the element of predictability, Prufrock also uses the words "come and go" which is an indication of events in Prufrock's life passing him by as he ages. I think the reference to Michelangelo does not simply allow for the idea that the women are discussing art and trends but hints Prufrock's concept of what the women speak in favor of: Michelangelo is a historical figure who was able to leave a legacy of art behind. Prufrock has no such legacy and appears hopeless that he will never leave his own mark in time or be the object of favorable discussion amongst the women. I think this idea also complies with your opinion on Prufrock\u2019s pessimism.
\n
\nThere\u2019s another part in the poem where women indicates Prufrock\u2019s perception in time. When Prufrock discusses the unfortunate prospect of having to be examined by the eyes of the female guests at the party and when he inserts his own recollections of what the women look like, he repeats the word "known," ending two lines with "known them all-" (55, 62). To have known something is to have already lived through an experience, so, in this case, one can assume that Prufrock is concentrating on the passage of time by elaborating that he has experienced people and social gatherings to the point of predictability.","dateCreated":"1265811501","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"jyang10","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/jyang10","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20016455","body":"I think the setting deals with not only PHYSICAL, LITERAL setting but also mental setting: "through narrow streets" - In physical terms, he is talking about narrow streets. But mentally, this refers to a difficult path, an obstacle.
\n
\nThere are also sections of the poem that don't directly describe a physical setting, but hint at a certain setting:
\n"Do I dare
\nDisturb the universe?
\nIn a minute there is time
\nFor decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse."
\nThis part of the poem does not tell us where the speaker is in a straightforward way, but by analyzing the speaker's thoughts, we can tell that he is almost at the door of the room.
\n
\nAlso.. inside of the room vs. outside of the room: inner personality of the speaker vs. outer skin? Is there any connection..","dateCreated":"1265817735","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"anniexbananie","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/anniexbananie","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}}],"more":0}]},{"id":"20008219","dateCreated":"1265795352","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"goblinj","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/goblinj","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"},"monitored":false,"locked":false,"links":{"self":"https:\/\/kisapenglporter2009-10.wikispaces.com\/share\/view\/20008219"},"dateDigested":1532170841,"startDate":null,"sharedType":"discussion","title":"4. How does this poem reflect modernism and your other experiences of modern literature?","description":"Simply, the chaos within the poem(which is more than apparent) makes it a clearly modern poem. The poem just goes back and forth, back and forth between positive and negative notions that it is way too confusing. Just like the modern painting, it takes much out of the reader to figure it out.
\n
\nOther than the chaos, the lack of optimism is apparent as well. The ending is not optimistic at all, and the wavering of self identity is clear as well.
\n
\nI think that the Cuckoo's Nest is an example of modern literature. It involves chaos and a pessimistic look about society(although it ends semi-positively).","replyPages":[{"page":0,"digests":[{"id":"20008747","body":"I agree with in that the choas presented within the poem's content reflects the modernism. I also think that the poem's unconventional structure, use of different languages, and the embedded stream of consciousness add to its reflection of modernism.","dateCreated":"1265799213","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"dabinl","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/dabinl","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20008829","body":"I also agree that this poem has all the characteristics of modernism that we discussed in class. The chaos, and pessimistic narrator were the two clear things as you mentioned.","dateCreated":"1265800002","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"brians10","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/brians10","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20008991","body":"I totally agree! J. Alfred Prufrock\u2019s unstable characteristics reflects modernism. Prufrock is shy, cultivated, oversensitive, ruminative, isolated, self-aware to the point of solipsism, as he says, "Am an attendant lord, one that will do \/ To swell a progress, start a scene or two." The speakers of early poems used to see the world with unflattering exactness, and make self-serving explanations. However, after Prufrock, poetry starts to become more complex, chaotic, and unstable.","dateCreated":"1265801110","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"jyang10","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/jyang10","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20009199","body":"I definitely agree that this specific poem contains many of the characteristics that we discussed in class, which include chaos, futile, pessimism, unstability, loss of faith, collapse of morality and confused identity. The poem is written in a form of stream of consciousness; hence, there is no order or balance in the poem, but it is rather all over the place. Because of the latter characteristic, modern literature works often require "outside of the box" thinking and therefore can be very confusing to the readers. Last year, we read Hemingway's short story called "Hills like White Elephants" and it talks about a man and a young girl who is talking about abortion and pregnancy. They say this in a very indirect way, referring to liquor, hills that are shaped by elephants and etc. I thought the poem and this short story are similar in a way that they are both indirect, chaotic, and question human life and morality. Put simply, modern literature works frequently question simplest things like one's own existence, faith, morality and etc.","dateCreated":"1265802832","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"chaerij","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/chaerij","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20009271","body":"Yeah. But one thing is that i don't think(personally) that the poem has optimism nor pessimism. It is definitely not optimistic, but the piece is not entirely pessimistic either. I think that is a part of modernism: neutrality, and not definite positive or negative opinion.","dateCreated":"1265803281","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"goblinj","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/goblinj","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20013505","body":"I feel like the poem matches the feeling of After Dark by Haruki Murakami perfectly. In the novel, the readers are given the sense of despair and pessimism--just like Ilmin mentioned. But then, we as the readers also discover that at the end of the night, there is some optism left in the society.","dateCreated":"1265813843","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"mikebock","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/mikebock","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20015143","body":"The characteristics of modernism that we came up in class were: chaos, futile, pessimistic, unstable, loss of faith and collapse of morality. There is definitely chaos, especially towards the end of the poem. Prufrock starts using all different kinds of punctuation and adds questions and exclamations here and there. Stream of consciousness. And I think the speaker goes back and forth between being optimistic and pessimistic - there is a clear distinction between the two in certain sections of the poem. This ambivalence is a part of the instability of the author\/speaker.","dateCreated":"1265816377","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"anniexbananie","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/anniexbananie","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20042089","body":":)","dateCreated":"1265846703","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"lporter","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/lporter","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20055279","body":"The rhyme scheme of this poem seems to reflect Modernism in that I couldn't really see a definite pattern to the rhyming and the length of the stanzas also varied. I think this adds to the idea of rejecting previous norms entirely, and accepting disorder and confusion.","dateCreated":"1265866518","smartDate":"Feb 10, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"rachelrox","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/rachelrox","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20061673","body":"Modernism, a makeshift artistic movement during the early 19th century, was focused on making sense out of concepts, words, pictures, that really didnt mean anything. It was a subversive, momentous retaliation against the logical cogitation that pervaded the Enlightenment era.
\nLuve song of J Alfred Prufrock genuinely reflects this era, in that it is chaotic. Chaotic, disheveled, delirious, psychedelic \u2013 these are the words that describe the overall feel of the poem. Prufrock, jumps from image to image, from place to place, from idea big and small, to finally come to some twisted romantic conclusion \u2013 if not a homage to the mermaids. It is almost written like a \u2018stream of consciousness\u2019 style of narration. The author is in the room with the ladies in one line, and walking on the beach the next \u2013 it reflects Prufrocks wandering, homeless mind that craves from something extraordinary.
\nThis sense of chaos can be also seen in writings of the modernist author Hemingway. In his novel, The Sun Also Rises, he describes the confused lives of the Lost Generation. The characters in this novel extravagantly waste money, go out and party, and drink booze. They are hedonistic group of friends that, through their fiesta-ing, attempt to forget about the harsh reality they find themselves in. I saw this idea in Prufrock\u2019s poem \u2013 he too, wants to desperately escape from the world; he dares to \u201cdisturb the universe.\u201d","dateCreated":"1265895850","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"yongminc10","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/yongminc10","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}},{"id":"20091075","body":"--","dateCreated":"1265928787","smartDate":"Feb 11, 2010","userCreated":{"username":"lporter","url":"https:\/\/www.wikispaces.com\/user\/view\/lporter","imageUrl":"https:\/\/ssl.wikicdn.com\/i\/user_none_lg.jpg"}}],"more":0}]}],"more":false},"comments":[]},"http":{"code":200,"status":"OK"},"redirectUrl":null,"javascript":null,"notices":{"warning":[],"error":[],"info":[],"success":[]}}